Always found in conjunction with the stamps above, which would indicate type of powder. Hey I have a F. Dumoulin & Co. 12 gauge side by side with double hammers. Thanks! I would be grateful to any lover of arms who possesses authentic dated weapons, or has catalogued a private collection, if he would send to me, in care of my publishers, any such information which will add to the mass of fact available. Hand Guns 5 Rifles-Shotguns 1 . Measuring the bore diameter and chamber 2023 Military Pay Chart Military Ranks DoD Dictionary Conversion Calculators Military Alphabet Code Military Map Symbols The "Military Factory" name and MilitaryFactory.com logo are registered U.S. trademarks protected by all applicable domestic and international intellectual property laws. JavaScript is disabled. Second Variation serial numbers 707517-851751 (7,000 produced) - 708921. 1840-1860. Ancion Jacques & Cie
for identifying the acceptance and proof marks as it appears, many He designed iconic guns like the M1911 handgun, the Browning Hi-Power pistol, and the Browning Auto-5 shotgun. Pictures would help! Forum, http://www.littlegun.be/arme belge/artisans identifies d/a delcour dupont gb.htm, http://damascus-barrels.com/Belgian_All_Proofmarks.html, http://damascus-barrels.com/Belgian_Trade_Marks.html. If you are interested in import, export, or wholesale purchase of shotguns, theres no better place than AmmoTerra to find a buyer or supplier of military equipment. Marks, Arsenal & Inspector Marks, Manufacturers Comblain Dieudonn Joseph
Thanks Brandon. Bodson N.
Any idea how to date it? LLH (and other Belgian makers) made the tubes used by most of the U.S. double gun makers 1920s-1940s, with Siemens-Martin or Krupp (by license) steel supplied by Cockerill. Home | Login | Register. I'm a ypunger collector/gun activist. Bernard Henri Eugne
arsenal marks, you will find other marks or stampings. The IZh motorcycles and automobiles are manufactured by. The only other markings I have seen are along the length of thr barrel \ \/ | . I'm very excited about this gun because I think the serial number is 106. Weight of proofed barrels, after 1924 fractions of grams no longer used. SCH or EC is abbreviations of the powder: SCH meaning Schultze. A voluminous schedule of rules and scales of charge for the proof of various kinds of small arms is in existence, and the proof is the same at London and at Birmingham; though different proof marks are employed. Belgian Liege gunmakers
Bastin Frres
I believe you'll find that the E in a diamond symbol is the mark used by the Timothy Eaton company of Toronto Canada. [Later note: Gerhard Wirnsberger has written. We provide antique gun prices and pictures of each antique firearm we sell. Prices: side-by-side, from 53,000 + VAT; over-and-under, from 65,000 + VAT. Photos of the flats on the barrels and on the action would help a lot. Sorry for my delay in responding: I've been OOT and off-line for two weeks. A Adaptive Tactical Shotguns American Tactical Shotguns B Baikal Shotguns Barrett Shotguns Benelli Shotguns Beretta Shotguns Blaser Shotguns Browning Shotguns C Century Shotguns Charles Daly Shotguns Chiappa Shotguns Inspector's marks can not be used to establish date of manufacture; they were re-used over time and the significance of some has been lost. The fifth a crown, with three crossed spikes set over a capital E. Other French towns had their special marks, such as Tullea three spiked crown or mitre above a capital E (as shown below). Thank y'all again! A.H. Fox guns came in 12-gauge, 16-gauge, and 20-gauge. Sixteen-gauge guns generally fall somewhere in between. After this, the firearm is examined to make sure it is still intact and if so, the metal (usually the barrel) is stamped with . Today, quality 12-gauge field grade guns from all the American makers during this era can be found and purchased for less than $1,000. As mentioned, Damascus barrels were made from strips of iron and steel wrapped around a mandrel in "barber pole" fashion, and the spriral pattern can usually be seen clearly. the examiner in determining the caliber designation of a military Baker, David J. production. I have not fired it. gfk0W2|Z#C7xA5 2`f)Hj'[iZWMU=|J-T `)Mtex=]m$azBbk>$QPB
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;U}LuB+2aki!Ld1QNUwr$Oaj9,U1Oe~N2u]6;&?a'LOe3 NIIS/\4fFIGXT[,(rN]3"!2(4YBd^VUY:;jWCJ^f"X.2X:l\d>|D}#&Ofw`Rv|$6&)M If I was asked for a guess for a dollar I would say mid 1930's. In its small version its a acceptance mark on barrels that was exported in a unfinished state 1846-1893, In its small version its a black powder mark on small pistols and revolvers barrels 1866-1893, In its small version its a black powder mark on small revolvers cylinders 1866-1893. Technically the company is owned by Belgium firearms maker FN Herstal. << /Length 5 0 R /Filter /FlateDecode >> Very long barrel. manufacturers identifying marks, more commonly referred to as Proof Marks, Arsenal or Inspector Marks Hi, thanks for the info and knowledge you provided. The blue is rough but the action works. Counet - Genot
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Since the evolution of the modern side-by-side and over/under hammerless shotguns in the late 19th Century, Belgian gunmakers have turned out some of the best. Any ideas as to date range? significance or purpose. The fourth the crossed branches, with the letters S.E.E., and a cross in their angles. have a great day! Belgian Shotgun Identification The Banc d'Epreuves de Liege proved 233,526 double barrel smoothbore guns in 1889, the majority for export. Bertrand Antoine & Fils
Barrels are not rifled- does this mean it must be a shotgun? You can also browse other antique pistols for sale or additional categories as diverse as Colts, Winchesters, and antique long guns. How do I price this piece? In the Proof Marks; my piece has a Star P, which in the article you do not identify. These firearms The Lion Rampant over PV was applied to the Optional Supplementary Smokeless proof for shotguns in 1898. Designates rifled barrel. Can anybody shed some light here? . Antique Shotguns (Pre-1899): Belgian Shotguns, Side by Side Shotguns Our inventory of antique shotguns is made up of shotguns manufactured before 1899, including English, French, and Belgian shotguns. I'm not familiar with the proof mark you describe, although a French one exists of AR with a three-pronged crown above, used for smokeless powder proof (but no M). Come join the discussion about optics, hunting, gunsmithing, styles, reviews, accessories, classifieds, and more! In 1899 alone, the U.S. firms of Hartley & Graham and Simmons Hardware bought 90,000 shotguns, rifles, and handguns from Liege gunmakers. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Hand Guns 2 Rifles-Shotguns 0 . If you can, send me a photo: ghcox3@gmail.com.Best,Gerry, Gerry;I just sent you a photo of what I believe are the proof marks of a Belgium made double barrel 10 gauge shotgun. Email: ghcox3@gmail.com. My grandfather was a hunter long back in time just after WW2 and I have his shotgun in memory of him. A "Greener" double? Bernard Victor & Cie
Email: Info@hlebooks.com
The gun belonged to HH Nawab Ahsanullah. In 1888 it was decided by a joint meeting of the Gunmakers Company and the Birmingham Guardians that a new supplementary proof for smokeless powder should be instituted in 1893, 1896, and 1904; the rules were further adjusted to allow for new powders. It could be almost anything: an English Greener, which would have Birmingham, England, proof marks, or it could be a double of dubious origin. Originally evolved by the armourers themselves, the system of proof was in nearly every arms-producing country taken over by the Municipality or the State, who imposed a series of stringent by-laws and penalties on any who sought to evade the prescribed tests. A strong good product that will last for long usage in your
reference books that display proof marks and their meanings. insight about the gunmaking activity in Belgium from its very beginning to the middle of
and BELGIUM had a glut of old, obsolete flint lock and percussion gun parts left over from years past. One of the lesser known of the Belgian handgun makers was Jean Warnant but he was a creative designer and the British Thornton's Patent for a double action revolver lock work was actually originally his idea for which he applied for a patent in Belgium in 1874 and that patent was granted in 1875. I have pics of the Proof marks I want to show you. examiner must rely on proof marks when trying to identify these Markings on gun barrels and other gun components that indicate the level of pressure, calibre and standards that a weapon is fit for in service.. You can easily choose the shotgun you need on Ammoterra.com. Original British Martini-Henry Rifle Extractor Mk IV From $34.95 Free Domestic Shipping on orders $300+ Hassle Free 30 Day Return Period 100% Safe Secure Checkout Guaranteed Authentic to the Historical Period On barrels and actions of smoothbore guns with the gauge size (or nominal bore) plus the shell or cartridge case length. It is located just above the circle with ELG. Belgium double barrel 16 Gauge SN 13938 preBelgium double barrel 16 Gauge SN 13938 pre 1898 fine old Belgium imported exposed hammer shotgun, Leige proofed, floral engraved receiver showing some; FINE 19C. 1840-1860. Comblain
Most specimen marks are of this nature, and it is no unusual thing to find the marks of two different smiths upon the same weapon, one man signing the lock work, the other being the barrel maker. to share our findings by this means of communication. to identify the manufacturer. Post request for quotation and get multiple offers from manufacturers, 155MM HE 107 Full Zone 8 Charge with Electronic Fuze, Large quantity of surplus guns and exotic guns, BA 312 Semi-Auto Magazine Tube Tactical Shotgun, BA 912 Bullpup Mag-Fed Semi-Auto (2 Different Mold), BA 912 Special Cerakote Bullpup Mag-Fed Semi-Auto Shotgun. Liege, Belgium has been a gunmaking center for centuries. Are you sure they are Damascus and not perhaps fake Damascus made by etching a spiral pattern on solid steel barrels for those who liked the look of Damascus? 1890, double bbl shotgun, 12 ga, 30" bbls. Again, thank you Just as many muzzleloaders were converted to breechloadersthink of the Springfield trapdoor action or the British Snidermany pin-fires were converted to center-fire guns. CLIMAS Tradename used by J. Stevens Arms Co. on guns. "Cueruy" could be the maker. Bury Jules. These marks are the Belgian Lion rampant over the letters S.C.H. "Any maker's name or place of origin? To make purchases and use the full site services, register or login your account. Their total production was around 180,000 guns. Serial Numbers. The second is the crossed branches, with the letters A.E. Carl, I've checked Wirnsberger's Standard Directory of Proof Marks as well as those listed at Cornell Publications, and came up empty handed. and hardbound book, written in English and French by Alain Daubresse, provide an extensive
Last edited on 20 February 2023, at 21:10, https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=List_of_firearm_brands&oldid=1140599647, Air defense equipment, artillery, munitions, explosives, ED devices, industrial machinery, Ammunition, Suppressors, Outdoor products, Clothing, Civilian, law enforcement, military, security, Suppressors, rails/handguards, accessories, ammunition, clothing. Proof so that means it is for sure a 12 gauge? They are often found in combination with proof-marks, and still more frequently on unproved arms made in countries where no official proof was existent. Chaumont M.J.
Can be without star and ring. Example of inspectors mark, any letter can be used with a crown. into which each separate book is dealing with a small portion of the whole, and that is
But despite the history the belgian proof stamps are rather straight forward, normally one cant get more information from the proof more than it has been done if one cant find the inspectors mark. Thank y'all for your help ahead of time! I'm very excited and can't wait for some replies. Liege, in Belgium, has always been celebrated for its weapons, and established its proof house as a municipal enterprise on May 10, 1672, when it was laid down that barrels should be marked with the stamp of the city, and unproved weapons might not be sold under pain of a fine of a gold florin and the confiscation of the unproved barrel. Berleur Michel
Those are about the only other possible sources of information, and probably won't narrow it down much more than what we know: second half of the 19th century, but before 1892.Best,GerryBest. Outdoor Hub, LLC (d/b/a Carbon Media Group), 30800 Telegraph Rd, Suite 1921, Bingham Farms, MI 48025 USA. OldGuns Newsletter . I can't tell if it was proved for nitro: those have a lion over the PV. Hi Gerard and everyone! Search. proof marks. Hi, your shotgun was made after 1924 due to the Perron-Liege proof marks. Key Findings. Guns and rifles built in Germany and the German principalities before the 1890s typically did not carry proof marks, but the 1891 proof law "grandfathered" these arms by mandating that they be submitted to the proof house and marked with a crown-over-V, the V standing for vorrat or "on hand". Brancquaert Louis
manufactured firearms, such as pistols from Spain and Italy, will list a He received his technical training in Soest and then in Warstein. HI, John. Using a shotgun shell (a self-contained cartridge with multiple small, sphere-shaped projectiles) instead of a usual bullet is what makes a shotgun a separate kind of a gun.